Goblins versus Empire.

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Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Aeyliea » Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:50 pm

Continue the topic of last age to this one, only in different faiths. This needs to be bumped since I am having to explain to my members why I am not bothering with threats or declarations against Goblins.

Duathi, your style of play is not appreciated with so few people here playing anyway. I lost one last age due to it, and I am unsure about Rob and his outlook on this thing - he didn't have to deal with your ages-old bullshit last age, so he doesn't understand why you did what you did.

I do. Maybe one age I will spend an entire age pinning your two realms to a hit from dead and see how you like it. Not this age though.

Perpetual war on.
Now nimble fingers, that dance on numbers / Will eat your children and steal your thunder;
While heavy torsos that heave and hurl / will crunch like nuts in the mouth of squirrels.

Yeah, its Seska. Start running now, bitch.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Reylan Talonspyre » Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:29 pm

If I remember correctly, I believe I used to get hit by Dauthi and Goblins on a regular basis. Oh man did I complain! We are talking like September 2008, if my reading of Temper's Ball is correct. My argument at the time was that the kingdoms being whittled down made the guild I had much weaker. I can see why you would think this would not be conducive to play in such a small population, but then again, you could also look at it as the building of a great rivalry.

In fact, if I remember correctly, there were guilds that justified hitting a smaller guild on the basis that Dauthi's guild was involved in a war with them. Please bear with me as I get my feet wet in a game I haven't seen since around that time. Where was I? Ah yes, well the idea, of course, was that this would get everyone, of every faith, upset with Dauthi and thereby force the faiths to punish them continuously. This did happen, I believe, but Dauthi never left. He didn't complain about it. In fact he held true to his Barnaban beliefs.

Man was that a pain in the ass during that time. But if I remember correctly, which who knows if I am, that ended up being a pretty fun age. I guess it all comes down to how you handle it.

I think perpetual war sounds about right and I doubt Dauthi would disagree.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Kaz » Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:49 pm

There are two big differences this age which go in the favour of defending against Goblins-like attack behaviour.

1. Kingdom Restore enables you to get back most of the land lost.
2. Modifications to the code preventing downhit declarations, now allow you to declare on kingdoms that attacked your allies. The alliance needs to exist when the declare is made, not the attacks.

As long as you don't wait for Dauthi to fill up his vio slots with other kingdom numbers (thus removing the 'recently attacked' state) for each kingdom dropped, three other kingdoms in the guild can theoretically grow by allying with kingdoms that are taken down, and then declaring war.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Darnivan » Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:16 pm

Because dauthi keeps his kingdom 4-5k acres there is no benefit to attacking him. He is attacking those with little to no defenses so he doesn't need many troops so even if you hit him down to 400 acres it only delays his next attack by like a day and the person attacking uses far more turns than is was worth to get those acres and are worse off than if they just built, effectively doing indirect damage to his attacker.

At least with the restarting those hit only lose 25% of their kingdom and, more importantly, get 2 more days on NPP to build up and get a few defenses.

It really makes building a non-goblin kingdom interesting. When building my Goblin and Human my Goblin I didn't worry about being attacked so much the first few days while with my Human kingdom I always made sure I had enough defenses to stop Dauthi. For a while my expenses on my human kingdom from forts alone were 75% of my income. It was annoying but in the end both kingdoms have turned out about the same at this point. :)
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Aeyliea » Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:54 pm

I am quite fine with dealing with him like always: Ignoring him. He is not worth the trouble of fighting unless its following a war that I have lost, in which case its something else all together.

But some people have not been .... taught, about him, because they shared the same faith in previous ages. They will learn.
Now nimble fingers, that dance on numbers / Will eat your children and steal your thunder;
While heavy torsos that heave and hurl / will crunch like nuts in the mouth of squirrels.

Yeah, its Seska. Start running now, bitch.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Darnivan » Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:25 pm

Heh, there should be a warning for the other faiths when they make non-goblin kingdoms :)
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Nagash » Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:12 am

The warning is: keep at least 250 forts. Do that and Dauthi won't be much of a danger.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Dauthi » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:32 am

Or you can keep crying about me and eventually make it so I feel guilty that I'm trying to play a video game, and cause me to rather go play other video games instead.

Or do what Nagash suggest and stop crying.

your choice really.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Gili » Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:44 am

....or convert to Goblin race :D (I switched away this age, don't hit me Duathi :P )
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Reylan Talonspyre » Sat Apr 13, 2013 9:50 am

:-)

I like this game.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Aeyliea » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:34 pm

Perhaps it would be a major benefit to those you hit to communicate with them in some way, so they understand what and why. Instead, you make GMs have to deal with it, or make new players that do not know any better deal with it.

No, I do not think you should quit playing, but then again no, I do not think you need be the cause of other people not playing, either.
Now nimble fingers, that dance on numbers / Will eat your children and steal your thunder;
While heavy torsos that heave and hurl / will crunch like nuts in the mouth of squirrels.

Yeah, its Seska. Start running now, bitch.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Reylan Talonspyre » Wed Apr 17, 2013 12:06 am

In a game, much like life, your actions have consequences. The difference between a game and life is that the person delivering the inputs (the player) must make choices that provide them the most amount of entertainment. In a Multiplayer game, this model does not change much. The experiences of other players is not the concern of the player trying to enjoy themselves. Especially in a game that is built to pit you against others.

If the new player you cultivated enters this arena and does not like what he/she is getting out of it (being attacked) then he should change his strategy. Kaz has implemented many changes to how the game operates to make death less ... hindering. I think they are very thoughtful and cool. It is an outside the box way of dealing with the smaller player base and some of the limiting factors of turn based games as well as some of the more arduous problems noted below.

We can argue semantics all night long, not that we are arguing, but Evernight/Monarchy didn't become a desert wasteland because of Goblins or anyone else. Not because of the attitude of players in the game. Not because of ISA. Not because of Fervent. Not because of TRC. Not because of the lack of role-play. Not because of anything in particular. It was because browser games fell by the wayside to an increasingly ADD population that likes, as the market shows you, glitz and abuse to your computer's video card. They like Apps like Candy Crush.

Our players, our wonderful players, dedicated their free time to new games with shiny and sometimes awesome appeal. It happens to all of us. I am glad to be here. It is fun to play and build and war. I am here because I missed this place and these sorts of discussions. Portia and I created the Facebook page to stay in touch with you all during a random chat there. You are all important to me.

But new players may find this to be somewhat difficult to understand and may get upset and leave. Let them go, it is no fun forcing people to play. In closing, if I end up being the cause of someone else quitting, then so be it. I will never advocate trying to force someone out of a game. That is just being a troll. What Dauthi represents to this game is the crazy old uncle who hurls racial slurs at your half-Hispanic girlfriend that are inaccurate and sometimes just downright confusing. You try to tell him she isn't a terrorist but he doesn't listen. At the end of the day, he is still your uncle and you deal with him like you deal with all your family ...

Down hit them when they aren't looking or scum kill them as a training exercise.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Gili » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:41 am

For what its worth, my personal opinion is i don't like what Duathi is doing. But if he finds it fun, then fair enough :) Its just hard work on others who are trying to play the Guild game. Really i think the Guilds need to have better coordination to keep him down and he'll get bored soon enough.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Dauthi » Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:31 pm

The problem is I got bored.... ask Kaz I've not bothered to rebuild my realms from the one time It got smashed down.

Why do you ask did I get bored? because no one was doing anything but building. I signed up for a war game. Not a building game, if I wanted to play a building game I'd play Sim City. With the rules in place making it harder to attack people, and with everything getting all upset that I attacked them, I got bored.

So I might check in randomly and use turns randomly, but enjoy your game of building.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Nagash » Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:06 am

You build to get in an optimal position for war. Warring and building are two sides of the same medallion.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Reylan Talonspyre » Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:05 pm

I actually agree with Dauthi that it does seem it is easier to build nowadays than war. I understand his point. I also agree with Nagash that it is two sides of the game. No one likes just building.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Kaz » Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:17 pm

Any war restrictions added only reduce the ability to declare kingdom vs kingdom war against a significantly smaller kingdom. So yes, I guess war is harder because now you need to actually declare wars against equals rather than just batter smaller kingdoms.

I think the problem is that the first response to being attacked is generally to complain. It's happened so often that people now just build because they are scared of the response to attacking. By response I mean the written response that comes via the boards or scribe, not the military response. This response defeats the whole purpose of having a war game. It's the reason why we didn't bring the guilds game back, it's the reason why over the last 15 years administrators have eventually get burnt out and given up.

However.

I'm hoping that this will start to change starting this age. The first war thread with restore enabled has happened without too much negativity. Fingers crossed it continues.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Nagash » Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:07 pm

Yeah, let's hoop that good vibe stays. :)

Restore gives the game a whole new dimension and in a sense, another dimension. I like it :)
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Igneous » Sat May 11, 2013 3:27 am

I love it.
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Re: Goblins versus Empire.

Postby Reylan Talonspyre » Sat May 11, 2013 11:00 am

I see they attacked your kingdoms too. LOL
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