Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

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Sturm-II
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:54 pm

Gerien wrote:
Sturm-II wrote:Is glad to see democracy wining and not incivility.
Riiiiight.
In the context that the lawmakers are continuing to work the kinks out in the HCR bill regardless of the latest rubberheaded madness, I posted about yesterday. :ugeek:
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Gerien
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Gerien » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:56 pm

I know, I know. Although the GOP's main web page shows Nancy Pelosi surrounded by flames, and Sarah Palin's website shows democrats in - literally - crosshairs. They claim the imagery means nothing. :roll:
And I never even got my own damn posting title!

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:13 pm

Yeah I saw the Palin crosshairs facebook thingy, the slapping motion of the Pelosi poster, the brick tossings, the reports of a gunshot, the white powder envelope, the nasty Stupak messages, the Oregon PD being hit with a bicycle, etc etc.

Makes a body wonder, for such a great and enlightened society to reduce itself to such a degree as to run parallel to extremist behaviour from other places around the globe.
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:29 pm

Gerien those complaints coming from the side of the isle that made several films and books about the assassination of Bush
Yep imagery only means something when from your opponents

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Bogumil » Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:00 am

Grunt, lately you seem to consistently justify abhorent behavior coming from people you agree with on the basis that "the other side started it". I find that to be rather disturbing.

I would have thought you would take umbrage over attempts to use force to subvert the democratic process in this country. I certainly don't care for this type of thing and it says quite a bit about where our country is when such tactics are employed.

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by tubs » Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:02 am

Haha, the GOP website is so unprofessional! They are letting themselves get taken over by their hardliners. It's a great shame. At least it makes great fodder for the Daily Show!

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by tubs » Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:34 am

You can be a Conservative and support a publicly funded universal health system; Winston Churchill was a Bolshevik.

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Nagash » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:13 am

Grunt wrote:Gerien those complaints coming from the side of the isle that made several films and books about the assassination of Bush
Yep imagery only means something when from your opponents

Examples please.



And you have to admit it that this propaganda by the GOP is rapidly degrading into simple threats and calls for violence. I don't remember the Democrats ever doing that, but if they did, please enlighten me.



One way or another, it's bad form. Regardless of who did what in the past.
If word gets out that I'm missing, 500 girls will kill themselves and I wouldn't want them on my conscience - not when they ought to be on my face!

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:03 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_a_President

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_a_President

There is a couple
Sorry man but I do not see the GOP calling for violence
targeting legislation and congressional seats is not an incitement to violence
Just as the recent calls that they were spat on and called racist names I also feel are BS
I have watched almost an hour of film now of the congressman who claimed such things and have seen none of it
Democrats are in perpetual victimhood
A leftist group at one of the first teaparties had an Obama sign with him as Hitler
it is the same group that started the Bush as Hitler signs
the media thought the Bush signs were funny and topical
The Obama signs on the otherhand were disgusting and a right wing ploy
I honestly feel the media slanders and smears the right on a daily basis in its selective reporting
"Let me get this straight. The new health care plan will be written by a committee whose Chairman says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress which hasn't read it, signed by a President who smokes, funded by a Treasury Secretary who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a Surgeon General who is obese, and financed..... by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong?" --Senator Scott Brown.

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:31 pm

Some of the calls for threats are from all accounts that i've heard watching the news, are stemming from some radio talk show hosts and call in commentators.
Some of the messages are from personal and office answering machines as reported by the victims on CNN.
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:38 pm

Yes sturm the left wing news wants to make the right wing into extremists
and the tea parties are racist

the fact is a Black man was attacked and hospitalized at a tea party
he was selling banners that read "dont tread on me"
he was assaulted by left wing SEIU thugs who the day before were told by the president
"they hit and we hit twice as hard"
the next day SEIU bussed in counter protesters who started all the violence
of course you do not hear that on your left wing news because it goes against the narrative
they are trying very very hard to make the racist and violent narrative against overwhelming evidence otherwise
It took the media months to cover the tea parties then they only did so to advance their narrative
the Coffee party got immediate NYT coverage
Tea party is true grass roots and coffee party is astro turf from the start
One got fawning coverage one is smeared
More Bottled Piety [Victor Davis Hanson]

This week’s talking point is the sudden danger of new right-wing violence, and the inflammatory push-back against health care. I’m sorry, but all this concern is a day late and a dollar short. The subtext is really one of class — right-wing radio talk-show hosts, Glenn Beck idiots, and crass tea-party yokels are foaming at the mouth and dangerous to progressives. In contrast, write a book in which you muse about killing George Bush, and its Knopf imprint proves it is merely sophisticated literary speculation; do a docudrama about killing George Bush, and it will win a Toronto film prize for its artistic value rather than shock from the liberal community about over-the-top discourse.

Socialism and totalitarianism are tough charges from the hard right, but they seem to me about as (or as not) over-the-top as Al Gore screaming “digital brown-shirts” or John Glenn comparing the opposition to Nazis. When 3,000 were murdered in Manhattan, and Michael Moore suggested Bin Laden had wrongly targeted a blue state, I don’t think that repulsive remark prevented liberal politicians from attending his anti-Bush film premiere. Yes, let us have a tough debate over the role of government and the individual, but spare us the melodrama, the bottled piety, and the wounded-fawn hurt.

Like it or not, between 2001 and 2008, the “progressive” community redefined what is acceptable and not acceptable in political and public discourse about their elected officials. Slurs like “Nazi” and “fascist” and “I hate” were no longer the old street-theater derangement of the 1960s, but were elevated to high-society novels, films, political journalism, and vein-bulging outbursts of our elites. If one were to take the word "Bush" and replace it with "Obama" in the work of a Nicholson Baker, or director Gabriel Range, or Garrison Keillor or Jonathan Chait, or in the rhetoic of a Gore or Moore, we would be presently in a national crisis, witnessing summits on the epidemic of "hate speech."

So here we are with the age-old problem that once one destroys decorum for the sake of short-term expediency, it is very hard to restore it in any credible fashion on grounds of principle when the proverbial shoe is on the other foot. A modest suggestion: If the liberal community wishes to be more credible in its concern about contemporary extremist anti-administration rhetoric, then they might try the following: “Please, let us avoid extremism and do not fall into the same trap as Baker, Chait, Keillor, Gore, Moore, or Range when they either expressed open hatred toward their president, or speculated about the assassination of their president, or compared their president to a fascist. We must disown such extremism, past and present."

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:04 pm

Nods heard about "Teabaggers" being likened to racists on CNN to, the program is called "Wingnuts of the Week" I believe.

Both sides with their various mediums have that fringe element that makes you just shake your head and ponder.
Your not a naive sir, remain impartial.
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Grunt
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:19 pm

Yep "impartial" CNN
They label all opposition to Obama as rooted in Racism
same with NBC ABC CBS
MSNBC went as far as showing a gun toting tea partier as a racist while cropping the picture to hide the fact he was Black

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:22 pm

I said you remain impartial.
Not whether you think CNN or any other medium is. ;)
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Grunt
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:42 pm

I try to hear all sides and create my own biases

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Gerien
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Gerien » Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:49 pm

And I never even got my own damn posting title!

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Grunt
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:18 pm

As I said the left will create the narrative will no actual evidence
A crowd of people yelling Kill the bill was labeled racist
Anyone who objects to Obama is labeled a racist
then they do not have to address your concerns

NPR is paid for with public funds yet has an agenda
When is the last time anyone at NPR talked about a left wing extremist or a left wing zealot
no they call them activists
no matter how many store fronts they demolish or cops they attack they are called peaceful demonstrators
Pour concrete on the tracks leading to the military base and that is just anti war sentiment
Blow up a marine recruiting station in NYC and it will be down played
have 700k people converge on the capital in a peaceful manor with zero arrests and even a clean grounds when they left
well they are dangerous right wing extremists with racist feelings

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:50 pm

Question:
NPR?
National Public Radio?
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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Grunt » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:56 pm

Yes
The health care overhaul will cost U.S. companies billions and make them more likely to drop prescription drug coverage for retirees because of a change in how the government subsidizes those benefits.

In the first two days after the law was signed, three major companies — Deere & Co., Caterpillar Inc. and Valero Energy — said they expect to take a total hit of $265 million to account for smaller tax deductions in the future.

With more than 3,500 companies now getting the tax break as an incentive to keep providing coverage, others are almost certain to announce similar cost increases in the weeks ahead as they sort out the impact of the change.

Figuring out what it will mean for retirees will take longer, but analysts said as many as 2 million could lose the prescription drug coverage provided by their former employers, leaving them to enroll in Medicare’s program
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art ... QD9ELVL3G1

It is already predicted to costs businesses hundreds of millions
that is exactly what businesses need to hire more people added costs
it will mean loss of benefits and or jobs

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Re: Health Care Bill: What Will Happen?

Post by Sturm-II » Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:06 pm

*tips hat
ty
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